The end of an era?
There seems to be a lot of commentary that the 'era of Aussie Dominance' is over, and 'India is now the Force in World Cricket'. I suspect a lot of this is fed by people wanting Australia to fail, mostly due to the whippings administered by us over the last 15 years and the arrogance exhibited by our team and their supporters. I can't help but feel partly responsible!
The beginning and end of era's are notoriously hard to define without the benefit of hindsight, as a changing of the guard can happen over many seasons. For a new era to emerge, one team will have to step up to consistently beat all others, both home and away.
To put the claims that India have achieved this into perspective, here's a quote from pommy blogger King Cricket.
After winning successive Test series against West Indies, South Africa, South Africa again, Bangladesh, England, Sri Lanka, India and West Indies, Australia finally lost away to India and are now ABSOLUTELY SHOCKING at cricket.
India’s recent run of losing a series against Australia, drawing one against South Africa, losing one against Sri Lanka before winning this one, hints that they are now perhaps the new supreme power in world cricket.
As for Australia's "decline" it's worth noting that they've never been overly impressive in India ; even in the "era of Baggy Green dominance" they only won a single series! The overall series ledger shows Australia with 3 wins (1956, 1969 and 2004) to India's 5 (1979, 1996 [1 test series], 1998, 2001, and 2008), with 3 Drawn (1959/60, 1964 and 1986 [1 Test Tied]).
I guess my point is that while the Aussie team has obviously weakened through the retirement of some legends, it's too early to say if there is another team ready to claim a decade as their own. Australia losing in India is nothing new, and losing there again isn't all that remarkeable.
India played well and full credit too them, but to be the world power that their population demands they'll have to cope with some big name retirements, and improve their away record vastly. In Dhoni they have the best captain in world cricket, and Ishant Sharma is a real talent who I hope stays fit and hairy.
India, Australia, South Africa, England and Sri Lanka all have strong Test sides at the moment, and are all capable of beating each other on their day. It's going to be an interesting period in Test Cricket and I can't wait.
Reference: Australia in India
| Posted by Moses on Thu 13 Nov |  17 comments |
Note: Originally blogged over at Beer and Sport
Here's the series results of Australia in India
1956
Aus 2-0
1959/60
Draw 1-1
1964
Draw 1-1
1969
Aus 3-1
1979
Ind 0-2
1986
Draw 0-0 (1 tied test)
1996
Ind 0-1 (1 test series)
1998
Ind 1-2
2001
Ind 1-2
2004
Aus 2-1
2008
Ind 0-2
Posted by Moses on 2008-11-13 12:16:41
Here's the series results of Australia in India
1956
Aus 2-0
1959/60
Draw 1-1
1964
Draw 1-1
1969
Aus 3-1
1979
Ind 0-2
1986
Draw 0-0 (1 tied test)
1996
Ind 0-1 (1 test series)
1998
Ind 1-2
2001
Ind 1-2
2004
Aus 2-1
2008
Ind 0-2
Posted by Moses on 2008-11-13 12:16:41
India has a long way to go before it can assert that they are the world champions. Beating a side that recently lost legends like Warne and McGrath, and who have a terrible captain in Ponting in friendly domestic conditions is not enough. If India can
1) Beat S. Africa in S.Africa
2) Beat Sri Lanka in Sri Lanka
3) Beat New Zealand in New Zealand (Yes, I have not lost my mind - look at India' record in NZ)
4) Beat Australia in Australia
Then, India can claim that they are the best team in the world. Even then, they cannot claim that their era of dominance has started because to call it an "era" there has to be atleast 5-10 years of invincibility, which Australia has shown over the past few decades.
Posted by Jeet on 2008-11-13 14:42:08
1) Beat S. Africa in S.Africa
2) Beat Sri Lanka in Sri Lanka
3) Beat New Zealand in New Zealand (Yes, I have not lost my mind - look at India' record in NZ)
4) Beat Australia in Australia
Then, India can claim that they are the best team in the world. Even then, they cannot claim that their era of dominance has started because to call it an "era" there has to be atleast 5-10 years of invincibility, which Australia has shown over the past few decades.
Posted by Jeet on 2008-11-13 14:42:08
The fact 'India is now the Force in World Cricket' is partially true, given the influence it has on any cricketing issue, though purely on account of her financial might and neither out of reverence nor cricketing ability.
Now compare this with a woman blessed with stunning looks and luscious figure making it into films. A bit of acting skills will make the world hail her to be the 'Next Big Thing'. But soon she'll realize that the skills and the skills alone will keep her alive. Neither the looks nor the figure.
India's case is very similar. She is being hailed as the new force more because of her financial might than the new found ability to win Test matches abroad. Though India have won recent Test Series in England and West Indies, they have lost in South Africa, Australia and Srilanka.
However, the real point is though India are not consistently winning Test Series abroad but they are consistently winning Test matches in every part of the world. Not a small achievement for a team that even till 1999 used to be whitewashed 5-0 or 3-0. The recent demolition of South Africa in South Africa for just 83 shows signs of coming of age. And the rate at which they are surging ahead, in a few years time they will be the team worth beating. Yes, at present, they are not the much talked about 'Force in World Cricket'.
But why does such a question arise from time to time? Because, clearly there's no undisputed 'Force in World Cricket'. The present Australian team is as mortal as any other. In fact some of the players selected wouldn't even make it to an Indian, Protean or Lankan team. No offence though, they are in a rebuilding phase. Every nation passes through it at some stage or the other.
So the new 'Force in World Cricket'? I wish I could ask the Almighty. At present, I would place the Aussie, Protean, Indian, Pommie and Lankan teams in the same sack and not necessarily in that order. Of course, some of them are on the rise and the rest on the wane. Hopefully, in a few years time, one of them would come out of the sack alive, vanquishing the rest.
Posted by Zapper on 2008-11-13 16:37:45
Now compare this with a woman blessed with stunning looks and luscious figure making it into films. A bit of acting skills will make the world hail her to be the 'Next Big Thing'. But soon she'll realize that the skills and the skills alone will keep her alive. Neither the looks nor the figure.
India's case is very similar. She is being hailed as the new force more because of her financial might than the new found ability to win Test matches abroad. Though India have won recent Test Series in England and West Indies, they have lost in South Africa, Australia and Srilanka.
However, the real point is though India are not consistently winning Test Series abroad but they are consistently winning Test matches in every part of the world. Not a small achievement for a team that even till 1999 used to be whitewashed 5-0 or 3-0. The recent demolition of South Africa in South Africa for just 83 shows signs of coming of age. And the rate at which they are surging ahead, in a few years time they will be the team worth beating. Yes, at present, they are not the much talked about 'Force in World Cricket'.
But why does such a question arise from time to time? Because, clearly there's no undisputed 'Force in World Cricket'. The present Australian team is as mortal as any other. In fact some of the players selected wouldn't even make it to an Indian, Protean or Lankan team. No offence though, they are in a rebuilding phase. Every nation passes through it at some stage or the other.
So the new 'Force in World Cricket'? I wish I could ask the Almighty. At present, I would place the Aussie, Protean, Indian, Pommie and Lankan teams in the same sack and not necessarily in that order. Of course, some of them are on the rise and the rest on the wane. Hopefully, in a few years time, one of them would come out of the sack alive, vanquishing the rest.
Posted by Zapper on 2008-11-13 16:37:45
No body here in India is feeling like India has become acricketing force by beating aussie in the last test series. Every one including retired test cricketers are telling its a long way to go for Indian team to gain that name of "Force in world cricket". The Indians have to beat England, pakisthan and Newzealand in next few days to come. Then they might think of that position.
Posted by postpraveen on 2008-11-13 19:23:10
Posted by postpraveen on 2008-11-13 19:23:10
"In Dhoni they have the best captain in world cricket, and Ishant Sharma is a real talent who I hope stays fit and hairy." These statements are true and I like them.
Posted by postpraveen on 2008-11-13 19:25:19
Posted by postpraveen on 2008-11-13 19:25:19
I guess the obvious question is does there always have to be a "cricketing force in world cricket". The West Indies were for a while in the 80's. Australia have been recently. But between that are long periods of time where no single team dominates the landscape. That seems to be where we're headed and most will say it's "good for cricket". Personally I hate that phrase as it usually comes after Australia loses.
Posted by JC on 2008-11-13 20:16:43
Posted by JC on 2008-11-13 20:16:43
I feel south africa are better suited to the task of becoming the next big thing. In Dale Steyn they have, in my opinion, the best fast bowler in the world at the moment. They have a strong batting outfit too, and I expect them to trouble Australia this summer. But let's not put too much pressure on them, they promised heaps before they landed in 2005 and were quite shocking.
Ishant Sharma is brilliant, but being an indian cricket tragic - i see these stars fade away quickly. I hope in his case it is not true, because India really do need a fast bowling superstar to be competitive outside india. I was as hopeful when Ajit Agarkar, Ashish Nehra, Irfan Pathan, L Balaji came along - where are they now? Although I must say that Ishant shows the most promise, simply because he has raw pace... but he ought to put on some beef or else those chicken legs are going to snap one day.
Posted by moody89 on 2008-11-13 23:01:36
Ishant Sharma is brilliant, but being an indian cricket tragic - i see these stars fade away quickly. I hope in his case it is not true, because India really do need a fast bowling superstar to be competitive outside india. I was as hopeful when Ajit Agarkar, Ashish Nehra, Irfan Pathan, L Balaji came along - where are they now? Although I must say that Ishant shows the most promise, simply because he has raw pace... but he ought to put on some beef or else those chicken legs are going to snap one day.
Posted by moody89 on 2008-11-13 23:01:36
@moody89
For South Africa and England to be the next big thing, they will have to have a spinner at least half the caliber of Shane Warne. For India or Sri Lanka to be hailed as such, they will need to have in their ranks a paceman atleast half the caliber of Glen McGrath.
That is why a prospect like Ishant Sharma for India makes a greater impact than a Dale Steyn for the Proteas. Because India has whatever else that's needed. South Africa on the other hand needs to boast of a quality spinner. We all know how the Proteas and Pommies fare against quality spin.
However, in spite of that, the current Protean team looks good but they just got thrashed by the Pommies! One must hide himself in shame, lest claim to be the 'Next Big Thing', when thrashed by the Pommies.
Posted by Zapper on 2008-11-14 01:27:44
For South Africa and England to be the next big thing, they will have to have a spinner at least half the caliber of Shane Warne. For India or Sri Lanka to be hailed as such, they will need to have in their ranks a paceman atleast half the caliber of Glen McGrath.
That is why a prospect like Ishant Sharma for India makes a greater impact than a Dale Steyn for the Proteas. Because India has whatever else that's needed. South Africa on the other hand needs to boast of a quality spinner. We all know how the Proteas and Pommies fare against quality spin.
However, in spite of that, the current Protean team looks good but they just got thrashed by the Pommies! One must hide himself in shame, lest claim to be the 'Next Big Thing', when thrashed by the Pommies.
Posted by Zapper on 2008-11-14 01:27:44
Individual capabilities doesnt matter when a team performs under a good captain. Let us look at teams rather than individuals and if possible captains too. After all a good player requires a good captain to show his talent. If captain doesnt want to use him, what a player can do. A captain makes lot of difference about players and team alltogether. A mediocre player could perform like shane warne or glen Mcgrath under a good captain, if used well.
Posted by postpraveen on 2008-11-14 02:49:01
Posted by postpraveen on 2008-11-14 02:49:01
moody89, I'd have agreed with you on Dale Steyn a few months ago.. shame he toured England then.
Posted by Moses on 2008-11-14 14:49:39
Posted by Moses on 2008-11-14 14:49:39
jc , i wouldnt agree with u also claiming that australia is weakened by greats retiring from the game!!!that shows the vulnerability in the domestic level of australia!!does it augur any good??
guys like ganguly,kumble retired..
and to follow are dravid,laxman..
shall i tell u that even if tendulkar retires , we dont face a problem? would u agree? well thats the fact actualy ..currently we have a lot of players sitting in the bench,who are so talented..
and the main reason why they say that australian era i lost because of the strength of the indian ODI side...and secondly its test side..
as a matter of fact, the australian top order did play well,,,they havent played poorly? winning against a team performing well is some kind of achievement and not winning against a team which is out of form..be it bangladesh in form or australians without form..
hence people proclaim that the australian era is over..
never have i seen indian team winning against australia back to back test matches, i mean the one in perth..then ones in india..
and also the whole CB series was dominated by india including the league matches..
Posted by purush on 2008-11-14 17:53:00
guys like ganguly,kumble retired..
and to follow are dravid,laxman..
shall i tell u that even if tendulkar retires , we dont face a problem? would u agree? well thats the fact actualy ..currently we have a lot of players sitting in the bench,who are so talented..
and the main reason why they say that australian era i lost because of the strength of the indian ODI side...and secondly its test side..
as a matter of fact, the australian top order did play well,,,they havent played poorly? winning against a team performing well is some kind of achievement and not winning against a team which is out of form..be it bangladesh in form or australians without form..
hence people proclaim that the australian era is over..
never have i seen indian team winning against australia back to back test matches, i mean the one in perth..then ones in india..
and also the whole CB series was dominated by india including the league matches..
Posted by purush on 2008-11-14 17:53:00
the main point here which people should agree is that "india is not the foce at the moment,rather that the gap of standard in teams is closing"
thats the reason why people say that the era of australia beating all teams is over,not just because they lost back to back to india..
look at the way current teams are growing..
india - undoubtedly(t 20 champions,not a fluke pls :))
south africa - a new force after hansie cronje ,under a very good captain called smith...
pakistan
ULTIMATELY my point is just that australia can never be the same australia it was not just for silly reasons like,bybye gilly,dilly,mc grath,warne and things like that/////other teams are catching and they started to play with the same intensity as the oz in the last decade!!!!
now pls prove me wrong gentleman!!!!:)
Posted by purush on 2008-11-14 18:02:28
thats the reason why people say that the era of australia beating all teams is over,not just because they lost back to back to india..
look at the way current teams are growing..
india - undoubtedly(t 20 champions,not a fluke pls :))
south africa - a new force after hansie cronje ,under a very good captain called smith...
pakistan
ULTIMATELY my point is just that australia can never be the same australia it was not just for silly reasons like,bybye gilly,dilly,mc grath,warne and things like that/////other teams are catching and they started to play with the same intensity as the oz in the last decade!!!!
now pls prove me wrong gentleman!!!!:)
Posted by purush on 2008-11-14 18:02:28
It is a fascinating debate - which only the dominance of all teams and conditions by the new pretender - India, will give it the mantle.
I think purush does raise a point - international cricket is following the trend in other big time international sports - that there is a standardisation of top level talent. Bringing the top teams closer together.
It makes sport more interesting, in my mind.
Remarkable talent will break through, but maybe it has to be even more remarkable than the last crop of Aussie geniuses.
As a Kiwi, the mention of India playing in NZ is true. The Indians have played atrociously on our wickets. It's like they were on a holiday, rudely interrupted by the cricket.
Posted by Perky @ cricketmystery.com on 2008-11-14 20:09:47
I think purush does raise a point - international cricket is following the trend in other big time international sports - that there is a standardisation of top level talent. Bringing the top teams closer together.
It makes sport more interesting, in my mind.
Remarkable talent will break through, but maybe it has to be even more remarkable than the last crop of Aussie geniuses.
As a Kiwi, the mention of India playing in NZ is true. The Indians have played atrociously on our wickets. It's like they were on a holiday, rudely interrupted by the cricket.
Posted by Perky @ cricketmystery.com on 2008-11-14 20:09:47
haha,, i agree with u perky,,but i still remember the last tour of india in newzealand...it was way back ,i think atleast 3 or 4 yrs back..
the attitude of this team is totaly different from the previous ones..
Posted by purush on 2008-11-14 20:48:42
the attitude of this team is totaly different from the previous ones..
Posted by purush on 2008-11-14 20:48:42
point taken zapper,
South African spinning stocks are quite dry.
Paul Harris seems ok. He's no Warne or Murali, but he goes alright. If he develops to even a 'respectable' spin bowler in world cricket, I still think SA will be the most dominant in years to come. Johan Botha is also a decent spinner.
You're probably right in that there is going to be a period where any team can beat any other team on their day, I just think south africa will do it more often than not. It all depends though, they are yet to prove themselves in Australia (as are many of the teams)
Posted by moody89 on 2008-11-14 23:22:00
South African spinning stocks are quite dry.
Paul Harris seems ok. He's no Warne or Murali, but he goes alright. If he develops to even a 'respectable' spin bowler in world cricket, I still think SA will be the most dominant in years to come. Johan Botha is also a decent spinner.
You're probably right in that there is going to be a period where any team can beat any other team on their day, I just think south africa will do it more often than not. It all depends though, they are yet to prove themselves in Australia (as are many of the teams)
Posted by moody89 on 2008-11-14 23:22:00
Well Perky, I too remember the last tour. Yes u won the series 2-0, but both games were close matches. The wicket was soo green and atrocious that for the 1st time in History both sides were bowled out for below 100 in the 1st innings. If India prepared such atrocious wickets (Indian wickets would be diferent as it would suit the spinners) then most countries will cry foul play (like SA in Kanpur) and ICC would head 50 enquires. However back to that series, a lead of 5 runs was considered good because invariably a team would loose 2 wickets before geeting to 5. Also Zak came good there, and we sorely missed the services of Srinath.
As for now, we have the following pace bowlers who will be effective in NZ:
1) Zaheer Khan
2) Ishant Sharma
3) Munaf Patel
4) Sreesanth
5) Praveen Kumar
6) R. P. Singh
7) Ashok Dinda (A real find of IPL. Swings the ball both ways and is nippy. Also has reverse swing. He gave a NZ - A team a tough time in India recently)
So India does not have dearth of fast bowlers.
As far as Batting goes, the following talent is available:
1) Yuvraj Singh
2) Rohit Sharma
3) Raina
4) M. Vijay
5) Virat Kohli
6) S. Badrinath
7) Shikhar Dhawan
8) Akash Chopra
9) W. Jaffer
Also I feel Dravid and Laxman won't retire for a a year or 2. So India will get the time to draft a few batsmen in place of Ganguly.
Spinners:
1) Amit Misra (leggie)
2) Pragyan Ojha (left armer)
3) Parmar (offie in Murali mode)
4) Piyush Chawla
5) Nanda (leggie more in Kumble mode)
Its a good bench strength that we have. Only depends on how we can draft them in
Posted by ssukhdial on 2008-11-17 19:39:22
As for now, we have the following pace bowlers who will be effective in NZ:
1) Zaheer Khan
2) Ishant Sharma
3) Munaf Patel
4) Sreesanth
5) Praveen Kumar
6) R. P. Singh
7) Ashok Dinda (A real find of IPL. Swings the ball both ways and is nippy. Also has reverse swing. He gave a NZ - A team a tough time in India recently)
So India does not have dearth of fast bowlers.
As far as Batting goes, the following talent is available:
1) Yuvraj Singh
2) Rohit Sharma
3) Raina
4) M. Vijay
5) Virat Kohli
6) S. Badrinath
7) Shikhar Dhawan
8) Akash Chopra
9) W. Jaffer
Also I feel Dravid and Laxman won't retire for a a year or 2. So India will get the time to draft a few batsmen in place of Ganguly.
Spinners:
1) Amit Misra (leggie)
2) Pragyan Ojha (left armer)
3) Parmar (offie in Murali mode)
4) Piyush Chawla
5) Nanda (leggie more in Kumble mode)
Its a good bench strength that we have. Only depends on how we can draft them in
Posted by ssukhdial on 2008-11-17 19:39:22
AUSSIES ARE GONNERS MATE.................No more aussie dominance in Cricket......
BCCI is gonna throw Aussie outta IPL/ICL, and theyr onna have no money to play, so Ive helped the players think about alternative jobs:
ANDREW SYMONDS:ZOO GUIDE
MATHEW HAYDEN:GYM INSTRUCTOR/ STREET WRESTLER
RICKY PONTING:CON MAN/ CASINO DEALER
SHANE WATSON: KANGAROO REARER
Rest they can decide upon their skill sets..........Most are originally English Convicts, so can get back to their ancestorial occupation of THEFT/ MURDER/ RAPE etc.whatever u best at!!!
Cheers Maite
Posted by INDIARULES on 2008-11-22 03:21:15
BCCI is gonna throw Aussie outta IPL/ICL, and theyr onna have no money to play, so Ive helped the players think about alternative jobs:
ANDREW SYMONDS:ZOO GUIDE
MATHEW HAYDEN:GYM INSTRUCTOR/ STREET WRESTLER
RICKY PONTING:CON MAN/ CASINO DEALER
SHANE WATSON: KANGAROO REARER
Rest they can decide upon their skill sets..........Most are originally English Convicts, so can get back to their ancestorial occupation of THEFT/ MURDER/ RAPE etc.whatever u best at!!!
Cheers Maite
Posted by INDIARULES on 2008-11-22 03:21:15
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